kiitos, ei kestä: UCSD students against the Koala

Good call Tamur, lets just suppress the voices of those we don't agree with...

I was thinking about this whole issue and honestly what it comes down to (whether you like the Koala or not) is that without the Koala WE'RE NOT EVEN TALKING ABOUT ANY OF THIS SHIT!

We're not talking about racial tensions on campus. We're not talking about racism in the community or social injustice that apparently now is the #1 issue around campus, above even the financial crisis that we're in. The Koala exists does NOT turn normal people into racists!

Honestly, when I read the Koala, it is obvious that the writing is satirical, not meant to be taken seriously. To me, its like watching an episode of a raunchier South Park. Do we march and demand that South Park remove Eric Cartman from the show for his racist and totalitarian views? No, because we recognize that it's NOT SERIOUS.

Yeah the Koala might be "racially insensitive" and definitely crosses the line of what is innocent, harmless humor. That is the point! I like the Koala because it brings a lot of issues to the forefront of our minds, and IS and HAS BEEN the fuel for the fire for ALL sides of MANY IMPORTANT ISSUES issues including this one, and THAT is why we need the Koala.

Much love,
David

23. Februar um 00:27 · Melden

Tamur Khan

I think you're absolutely right David. I agree with almost all of the stuff you wrote above, except for I trying to suppress the voices of those I don't agree with.

I never called for and am not calling for suppressing the voice of anyone. I'm not asking for any sort of coercive action to shut down the Koala. I do not think the Koala can be coercively shut down either.

What does that leave with us? Just trying to get together the different elements present withing UCSD who oppose the Koala.

Was this unclear? Do you think I should update the description? You can suggest something better.

Other than that, is getting together people with similar interests really that troubling to you, pro-koala people?

23. Februar um 00:37 · Melden

Tamur,

First off, the description does say "with the majority of students at UCSD vote, the Koala can be shut down" so it sees to imply that you want to SHUT DOWN the Koala. Maybe you meant retract funding for the Koala? You should make that more clear.

With that said, I think it is a bad idea and unfair to retract funding for the Koala. I have the view that the koala is GOOD FOR OUR UNIVERSITY for the reasons I stated above and I'm sure many other people would agree with me when I say that it gets people talking about issues, something that traditionally hasn't happened in our school which is marked by a sad apathy to non-academic aspects of campus life.

I'm not defending the Koala, I'm just saying we need THAT GUY to wake people the fuck up, and I think they deserve funding for fulfilling that role. And I'll restate that I think the Koala is satire made for that exact purpose.

In regards to your last comment...I 100% support your right to get together to bring your issues with the Koala to light...that is what free speech is all about.

23. Februar um 01:01 · Melden

@ David - I can see your point in your view that Koala brings out the things people don't want to talk about but I guess it's something I disagree. IMO, I feel like there are much better ways of dealing with really controversial topics without making a mockery of people's ethnicity or having pictures of dead Haitian children.

The picture of "The Night of the Horny Asians" really bothered the crap out of me as I saw ugly stereotypical images of Asians in buckteeth, straw hats, and yelling "ME LOVE YOU LONG TIME". If their intent was to get people talking, I think the meaning may have been lost as I think it was purely just for cheap laughs.

I guess that's what I think Koala is trying to do: to get laughs from very obscene and offensive images and written material. Some people get a kick out of that but I sure as hell don't. From what I've read, I don't think the Koala writers and editors are offering any insight on hot topic issues through wit and satire...I think they are only exploiting it for cheap laughs.

But hey, that's just my opinion.

23. Februar um 01:09 · Melden

No doubt, 3/4 of that shit is MEANT to make you cringe and get pissed off. That's where they get their shock value. But do you think that anyone's view of Asians, or the severity of the disaster in Haiti changed after seeing the Koala. Does anyone in their right mind actually takes that shit seriously and their messages to be what the writers truly believe?? I doubt it...

Perhaps there is a better way to shock UCSD from its state of apathy...but you have to admit that the Koala does that pretty damn well if you ask me. Satire (and yeah cheap laughs) is their form of artistic expression and its their choice, even if they take it to the extreme. I think they serve a valuable purpose on our campus, and I support their right to remain a funded organization.

23. Februar um 01:35 · Melden

This may be my recent exposure to living the Cali life (since I just moved here 3 weeks ago) but back in VA, there ARE people who do believe that Asians are like that or at least when Asian Americans protest against it, they scoff and tell them to get a sense of humor. As for the disaster in Haiti...well, you may have a point there, and if there was someone who took that seriously, I would seriously be worried for them.

Even still, shock value does have a purpose only when it comes with a message that has been crafted with forethought. I guess I just failed to see that from Koala so it is hard for me to support the magazine as an individual. Even if they have every right intention to make a social and political statement, I don't see it being fully fleshed out and as such, these images that people are getting riled up on can do more harm than good.

Nevertheless, it is good to have a constructive conversation on this. Far too often, emotions get thrown around in rampant tantrums and people, whether if one side is more right than the other, can say some truly mean things.

23. Februar um 01:43 · Melden

Sorry to burst your bubble, Edward, but there's aplenty of racism here in Cali too. My point was that the Koala is a satirical newspaper and they're not actually in accordance with the belief of what they write about. Like I said, its meant to shock students from their normal state of apathy.

As far as causing more harm than good...thats debatable. Sure, people get pissed off to see their race being stereotyped. I think the anger comes from the fact that people ACTUALLY believe that shit, and from the racial tensions in our society that exist PRIOR to seeing it right there in the Koala, bringing those things to life in the minds of the reader.

HOWEVER, look at all the dialogue that has come from this one incident involving the Koala. People sharing their opinions on these message boards, press conferences with the chancellor discussing race relations and the state of our campus climate at our university, demands presented by the BSU for action on making this campus more welcoming to minorities.

In addition, in previous years it has ALWAYS been the Koala that has been the first to call out the administration, Associated Students, and other newspapers such as the Guardian for questionable policy, poor event planning (see Sungod Festival), and not speaking out for the voice of the students enough. And I've seen this precipitate real positive change as far as accountability of AS and the Guardian in empowering the students of this University.

I'm not making the Koala out to be some righteous cause...but when they're gone who is going to bring all these issues to light? Nobody does that better than the Koala

23. Februar um 02:26 · Melden

I am fully aware of California's contradictory nature ever since Prop 8 has been passed, which is probably one of the most ridiculous acts to be passed in recent U.S. history.

It is at this point we will agree to disagree. I do not believe it is because of Koala that issues are being brought up, it is BECAUSE of Koala that we see these issues be blatantly disrespected. If it is true that the Koala said ""the ungrateful N****** who were not thankful for the party that was thrown in their cause", then I'm sorry, I don't find that acceptable at all. It is for this reason and the others that I mentioned that I do not support this magazine, which just happens to be the coin side opposite to why you support the magazine in the first place.

23. Februar um 06:26 · Melden

Who said anything about shooting people we do not agree with? Did I say anything about censoring Koala?

No, I am merely stating my belief that the Koala should be cut off from school funding and if the pro-Koala peeps want it that badly, they can fund it themselves.

From one person of color to another, from one Asian to another, I feel sorry for you that you think stereotypes about us are deemed acceptable. I'm sorry that you think of yourself in that stereotype you just mentioned above but if that makes you happy, then so be it.

At least try to understand where I am coming from. When I fight against incredibly demeaning assumptions people make about Asians and Asian Americans, I do it because there are so many people in this world who do not possess the media reading skills to think beyond what the media is telling them. I believe that race jokes can indeed be funny, but to mock a person's ethnicity just for the sheer sake of getting cheap laughs, I find this intolerable and this is something I fight against. Race jokes can be done right (example: Dave Chappelle) but it must be done with knowledge of what the hell you are making fun of.

Look, I'm not trying to tell you what you should believe or not believe in. If you think that I'm being oversensitive and that I'm making my Asians look bad, then fine. Be my guest.

But as I do this, I'm doing this so we as Asians and Asian Americans can be seen in an accurate, humane light.

Before I end this thought, I want you to check out a particular man named Vincent Chin. I want you to research his life and what his death meant and come back to me and tell me what you think. I'm going to guess that you have never heard of him and if that is the case, then please check him out and when you read about that man's life and how he was killed, then you will understand why I am doing all of this.

24. Februar um 00:25 · Melden

The problem here is that you retards don't know how the first amendment works.

Either you shut down ALL student-run media, or you fund the Koala. Sorry guys, in this one it really is a black and white issue.

24. Februar um 03:22 · Melden

Actually, it would appear that you are who doesn't know how the first amendment works. The fact is that the first amendment has nothing to do with this situation. You can say whatever you want on your own dime and your own time but the first amendment does not protect your funding. In fact you have no right to funding at all. Your funding is totally at the discretion of the administration of the UCSD or the student council, whichever one it is that your university relies upon to determine which requests for funding get approved.
Having taken some time to look at a few issues of your newsletter or whatever you want to call it, I find it amazing that you have ever gotten funding for it. Furthermore I find it inexplicable that it garners $2,300 in funding.
I've seen fanzines written by high school kids that are more well written and informative than this piece of trash. It's so obviously racist and hackneyed and the "art" is done at a 4th grade level. Leave it to over privileged white kids in California to self righteously pick at every under represented minority group available. It really takes guts to have so little to say yet say so much.
Your claim to first amendment protection has been rebuffed, if the UCSD's Associated Students feels like funding your rag then so be it but it remains at their discretion. Don't try to hide behind the first amendment.

24. Februar um 22:19 · Melden

Department of education code 66301
and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#United_States

Google motherfucker, do you use it?

24. Februar um 22:24 · Melden

Guys, keep it civil.

24. Februar um 22:41 · Melden

Nice language, you sure sound like a genius when you say motherfucker.

Don't conflate the federal and state government with the UC systems student associations. Don't conflate defunding with censorship or punishment. They cannot censor or punish you, they can defund you. Once again, in case you didn't understand it the first time, you have a right to free speech, you DO NOT have a right to the funding.

If you disagree go ahead and find the Supreme Court ruling that explicitly and specifically states that a student organization of a University can not deny funding to a student run newspaper under first amendment protection.

66301. (a) Neither the Regents of the University of California, the
Trustees of the California State University, nor the governing board
of any community college district shall make or enforce any rule
subjecting any student to disciplinary sanction solely on the basis
of conduct that is speech or other communication that, when engaged
in outside a campus of those institutions, is protected from
governmental restriction by the First Amendment to the United States
Constitution or Section 2 of Article 1 of the California
Constitution.
(b) Any student enrolled in an institution, as specified in
subdivision (a), that has made or enforced any rule in violation of
subdivision (a) may commence a civil action to obtain appropriate
injunctive and declaratory relief as determined by the court. Upon
motion, a court may award attorney's fees to a prevailing plaintiff
in a civil action pursuant to this section.
(c) Nothing in this section shall be construed to authorize any
prior restraint of student speech.
(d) Nothing in this section prohibits the imposition of discipline
for harassment, threats, or intimidation, unless constitutionally
protected.
(e) Nothing in this section prohibits an institution from adopting
rules and regulations that are designed to prevent hate violence, as
defined in subdivision (a) of Section 4 of Chapter 1363 of the
Statutes of 1992, from being directed at students in a manner that
denies them their full participation in the educational process, so
long as the rules and regulations conform to standards established by
the First Amendment to the United States Constitution and Section 2
of Article 1 of the California Constitution for citizens generally.

24. Februar um 23:21 · Melden

Ed, i wouldn't assume this guy can be civil. Look what he's defending. Civility is highly unlikely.

24. Februar um 23:39 · Melden

Even for the pro-Koala peeps, I've been able to get pretty constructive discussions with them. In the end, we may agree to disagree but the conversation was polite, respectable, and I was able to get a few insights from them that I normally wouldn't otherwise.

If I had to be honest, it's when people of color defend the Koala or anything of that sort that worries me. This may be my pompous assumption, but it saddens me when they defend things that mock their ethnicity and sexuality just for the sake of cheap laughs. Race jokes can be truly funny, only when the person knows what the hell he or she is talking about and does a followup with that (ie. Dave Chappelle).

Then again, maybe I'm too oversensitive and these said people of color will attack me. Whatever. I stand by my opinion.

24. Februar um 23:47 · Melden

People often hide their racist attitudes and beliefs behind humor. It's an excuse, "I'm not racist, I was just kidding". It doesn't hold water, especially when it doesn't go both ways. In what I saw when I looked at the Koala I didn't see one item that mocked over privileged and insensitive white kids that never really had to work all that hard for anything or Caucasians in general.
I didn't see anything funny in the Koala, it was all easy, humorless biased bullshit. I'd put it in the same category as www.stormfront.org or any other hate based organizations newsletter.

As for the people of color who have defended the koala, of which I haven't seen any. Those people may not have the same feelings towards the statements as they may not have dealt with the same circumstances as the majority of their racial cohorts. For instance, while one African American or Latino or Asian may have had a relatively easy and painless life and a not such a hard time in school, another may have had a harrowing existence in which every inch of progress had to be fought for with hard work and pain and suffering. They may have spent years dealing with seriously hateful people who actually believed in the stereotypes that are often presented in society.

People need to have a little more respect for each other. You have the right to say anything you want, but if you say something, or a series of incredibly shitty things people have the right to hold you accountable, which is something that has nothing to do with free speech. The first amendment protects you from the government, not the people.

25. Februar um 01:03 · Melden

Nothing from Lohith on the issue of first amendment protection, I'll just assume he's busy out spending mommy and daddy's money.

25. Februar um 01:18 · Melden

there was one person who commented that was Asian and basically, he was accusing me that I wanted to ban Koala or worse, go shoot them. After I wrote my response that went like "Who said anything about shooting people we do not agree with? Did I say anything about censoring Koala?" (posted above), the guy not only did not respond but also deleted his comment.

Weird.

25. Februar um 01:20 · Melden

Yea, he just wanted to throw out a nice straw man. Some people obviously misconstrue things or get them wrong or flat out imagine statements. He obviously felt like an ass once you corrected him.

25. Februar um 01:25 · Melden

People of color not defending it? Lol.

Name one actual white person in the Koala. Go ahead, I'll wait.

"(c) Nothing in this section shall be construed to authorize any
prior restraint of student speech."

This means that the content of a publication cannot be the basis for determining funding.

25. Februar um 11:38 · Melden

what does that even mean, lohith? that there are no white people as part of the Koala staff?

25. Februar um 11:45 · Melden

Ok, Lohith, just so you know...Prior means previously, or happening in the past. As in before now...

I know you think you can just pick out something that looks close and slap it up there and tell me what it means, but would you at least find something exists in the correct chronological reference.

So like I said before, find something that specifically and explicitly states that it is a violation of the first amendment to defund this paper.
You can't because it isn't. Give it up, you've lost to someone who actually understands the first amendment.

Also, just so you know. The restraint of free speech mentioned in what you posted is not funding related. It is censorship related, as in the school cannot request a copy of the paper prior(see how that word is used) to its publication in order to remove what it does not deem fit for print. That is a restraint on free speech. I suggest you get back to google and actually read what you post to a point that you understand it.

25. Februar um 13:25 · Melden

Prior means before you philistine retard. Prior restraint refers to regulating content before publication.

So if one publication is given AS funding to publish, then content cannot be used as a deciding factor before funding is allocated for publishing.

I actually hope you myopic bitches shut us down. Because then my hot MILF friend will sue the shit out of you and I will help set a fucking legal precedent.

My ethnic cock is already big enough, but if the BSU really wants true equality...

25. Februar um 14:01 · Melden

Oh yeah. The whitest people on the Koala staff are two Jews and a Mexican.

25. Februar um 14:03 · Melden

interesting.

so the staff of Koala are actually composed of POC making fun of themselves at their own expense. I see.

Judging from your comments, it doesn't seem likely there can be any more further conversation to come out of this. We will agree to disagree. You will do your part to make sure AS funds your magazine and we will do our part to make sure you guys get cut off. If we lose, we lose. And Koala gets to live on and spread their message of hate and ignorance...that's fine by me :)

25. Februar um 14:08 · Melden

The rule against prior restraint does not apply to the publication of student-operated school newspapers or the funding they are provided with.

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Prior+Restraint

As I stated very clearly before they cannot ask to view the publication in order to censor content on an individual basis. They can DEFUND it, there is NO RIGHT TO FUNDING.

As for your accusation of being a Philistine, since you seem to be a fan of the wiki here's a definition for ya.

Philistinism is a derogatory term used to describe a particular attitude or set of values. A person called a Philistine (in the relevant sense), is said to despise or undervalue art, beauty, intellectual content, and/or spiritual values. Philistines are also said to be materialistic, to favor conventional social values unthinkingly, and to favor forms of art that have a cheap and easy appeal

Hmmm, Cheap and easy appeal. Sounds kinda like the Koala.

The fact that you mention a hot MILF friend and having a big cock leads me to believe you have neither. Generally guys who feel the need to talk about how big their cock is really don't have that much going on downstairs. Here's a BBC article about that topic, I got a kick out of it.

Check out the title:
Condoms 'too big' for Indian men HAHAHAHA

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/6161691.stm

25. Februar um 14:15 · Melden

hear hear, jeremy.

25. Februar um 14:15 · Melden

He really made my point when he said he'd have to sue and set a precedent. Basically acknowledging that there is no precedent.

25. Februar um 14:22 · Melden

There is one, but Koala v. University of San Diego would pretty much be an especially nice "fuck you".

25. Februar um 14:41 · Melden

If there is a precedent post it and where it specifically and explicitly states that defunding a college newspaper is a violation of the first amendment protection of free speech.

25. Februar um 14:42 · Melden

Okay, what in your opinion would regulate which papers would get funding and which wouldn't from AS?

25. Februar um 14:49 · Melden

Andre Metzger

Lo, you had me at "ethic cock" - go koala!

25. Februar um 15:04 · Melden

Nice change of subject, in my opinion the UC system is so thoroughly broken that none of them should receive funding. The funds should be instead allocated to the teachers assistants who do the majority of the work. It's a matter of fact that the teachers assistants in the UC system are paid very little for the amount of work that they do in addition to the research they have to conduct in order to obtain their advanced degrees when compared to other university systems.

Honestly, it's not that hard to find a sponsor for a school newsletter. Unless of course it's so bereft of redeemable content that no company or organization would want to advertise in it. But, if the Koala did find a sponsor or two, it would mean more beer, maybe some colored pencils and color prints for the front page. I mean does this stuff not occur to people or are they just so used to being handed a few thousand dollars for nothing.

25. Februar um 15:06 · Melden

Andre Metzger

Honestly, how many TAs could we sponsor with Koala funding? If you don't like the koala, don't read it and stop worrying about a few cents out of your pocket. You should worry instead about the shitty looking buildings UCSD burned millions of your tax dollars on. Next time you walk to student health to get that rash on your balls checked out, take a good look at the new buildings around you... do students really need all that luxury to learn? Compare the cost of the Koala to RIMAC, the new Price Center buildings, or the the CalIT2 engineering building, you tell me where the money is being wasted.

25. Februar um 15:29 · Melden

It's not a change of subject. I need to know just how twisted your understanding of constitutional law is before you can be enlightened.

25. Februar um 15:47 · Melden